Episode 33: Building Calm, Confidence and Support in Business with Isabelle Pearcey

Hello and welcome to the Mum Means Business podcast, where we shine a light on inspiring women who have one thing in common. When they’re not managing tantrums, homework, P.E. kits and play dates, they are busting their gut to create something from nothing, to turn their passion into a thriving business and build a better life for themselves and their families. We dig into what motivates devoted mothers to pursue entrepreneurship and how they integrate their work and family life.

I’m Victoria Phipps, your host, and if you’re an ambitious mum in need of some solidarity whilst navigating the messy middle of making your big dream a reality, then stick around. This is for you.

NOTE: This is the transcript from the original recording, rather than the edited episode so timings may vary.

Victoria (00:04)
My guest today is the founder of is whiz VA where she helps founders, small teams and legal professionals bring structure, calm and confidence to the way they run their businesses. With a background in law, executive support and charity governance, she has spent years as the unflappable right hand to high level leaders, quietly creating effective systems, leading with empathy and keeping operations running smoothly behind the scenes.

Now growing a small trusted team of virtual assistants, Isabel Piercy is on a mission to empower women who want flexible, fulfilling work that fits around their family life. Women who are skilled, capable and ready to thrive by spending more time working on their business and less time working in it. As a business owner, Isabel says she is keen to role model resilience, resourcefulness and leading with kindness to her two children.

And think a lot of mums will relate to this feminine value-driven approach to entrepreneurship. Isabel, I am so looking forward to hearing more about your story. Welcome to the Mummy’s Business Podcast.

Isabelle (01:10)
Thank you so much. You’ve done your research, Victoria.

Victoria (01:16)
I try. It’s always quite panicked. But I think I love putting these intros together. I say it all the time because it just gets me in the zone. But also it’s really nice to hear everything that everybody’s already achieved because I think it’s a really positive way to start these conversations. So apart from what I’ve researched, I actually know very little about your journey into entrepreneurship and becoming a VA.

Isabelle (01:17)
You

Yeah.

Victoria (01:45)
Tell me what made you start a business of your own.

Isabelle (01:51)
⁓ Well, I’d like to say it was at the beginning when my children were really small or when my son was really small, ⁓ but I hadn’t really heard of people running small businesses. I think sometimes you need to be in the circle and to know people already doing it to sort of think, I could do that. And I didn’t. So, I mean, that’s something we can talk about, but… ⁓

At that stage, I was doing other things. But what actually led me into running my own business was having long COVID a couple of years ago. ⁓ yeah, and I just needed a new way. ⁓ And like I say, at that point, I started to see small businesses role modeled with women like me. And then you sort of think, ⁓ maybe I could do that. I’ll give that a go.

Victoria (02:23)
Okay.

Isabelle (02:39)
⁓ And I just couldn’t do anything else at that point because with the long COVID, I just needed to be able to ease into something gently. It didn’t actually work out that way. I have to say it took off really quickly. So I’ve been really lucky that I’ve been able to manage the two.

Victoria (02:49)
Yeah, absolutely. That’s completely understandable.

I was going to say I completely understand. I think definitely there’s something about COVID, you know, the rise of the online business. mean, of course they existed beforehand, but because all of us had to just get online to get anything done, to get your food shop, to make your purchases. And I think it kind of broke down a lot of trust barriers with the internet that perhaps had kind of lingered.

Isabelle (03:16)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Victoria (03:27)
because I mean, really, relatively speaking, we’re still in the early days of the internet. And in that sense, I agree. I definitely remember seeing a lot of kind of entrepreneurship kind of popping up through Instagram and social media. But what was that experience? Is this 2020 that you had long COVID? What was that experience like for you?

Isabelle (03:32)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Early

21 ⁓ and I mean it was appalling, it was horrendous. I had COVID quite mildly and at that point I was a charity manager ⁓ for ⁓ AIMS ⁓ which is a charity supporting mothers ⁓ with maternal services. ⁓

Victoria (03:53)
Okay.

Isabelle (04:15)
But at that point I was fine and then I tried to go back to work and within two days I just collapsed ⁓ and I was bed bound for three months. Yeah, so it’s been a really long journey and there’s lots of step backwards. You think you’re getting better and then you go backwards a bit. But yeah, quite frankly it was awful.

Victoria (04:27)
Wow.

Yeah.

And also your parenting during this time, you’re still being mom and with the children at home with you all that time. That’s so hard, I can’t imagine.

Isabelle (04:46)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It was quite worrying for them, I think, because I was a really fit person, ⁓ super fit. You know, I trained several hours a day, so I was really very active, full of energy. And then suddenly their mum turned from that person to someone that couldn’t lift their head off the pillow. So it must have been really hard for them to see that, but they were so brave and really supportive.

They used to come and see me when I was in bed. ⁓ are you okay? But I think that was my, yeah. So well, my daughter was only two, three, three going on four at that stage. So my son was a bit older, sort of like 10-ish.

Victoria (05:19)
Yeah.

bless them, how old were they then?

Yeah.

That’s young, isn’t it? To kind of deal with any sort of change, you know, that age, they’re still toddlers. They just need like complete consistency and they feel the whole world revolves around them. So I can imagine that was really difficult for you because you just want to be there for them.

Isabelle (05:38)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

But yeah,

it’s really sad, yeah. I was gonna say, they always are driving force, aren’t they? Because I’m sure I got my hope and positivity from wanting to model to them, know, mummy’s gonna get better. And then the more I said it, the more I believed it. And I just, even if I had like tears rolling down my face, because I couldn’t lift my head off the pillow, I still had this note, you’re gonna be better tomorrow.

And every day I would say to them and me, you’re gonna be better tomorrow. And the more you say something, the more you believe it. So, you know, after six weeks, I absolutely believed it because I told myself that’s what was gonna happen. So, but there’s that great driving force, aren’t they?

Victoria (06:35)
Yeah, it’s mind over matter.

completely. mean, fortunately, I haven’t had an experience like that when I’ve been completely out of action. But I know just from, you you get a bad stomach bug or anything like that, and you’re out of action for a couple of days and how that impacts them. But even then you feel a sense of, right, I need to get back on my feet because this household and this family is falling apart without me. So I can’t imagine to have been, it must have been so frustrating for you as well, But so did you feel that you,

Isabelle (06:51)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria (07:10)
literally did it, did that make your decision? You didn’t have the energy to go back to your previous job.

Isabelle (07:16)
⁓

I didn’t, but the trouble was I kept going backwards. So I would try to go back to work. It was a charity, a really small charity, and they relied on me to do everything from the ground all the way up. And it was a job I loved, a job I was passionate about. So I kept trying to go back. And in hindsight, I was going back too early and then having to go on sick leave again. And the guilt I felt for that and knowing that I was…

the only person that was keeping that running for them aside from the volunteers. I just thought they need someone new. I can’t just keep going off sick again and again and again. They didn’t want me to go and they were very supportive but I just thought I’m just gonna have to leave. It’s for the best for everyone. ⁓ And then I took some time. Yeah, it was, yeah. It was a really hard decision ⁓ and that guilt you feel. ⁓

Victoria (08:12)
That’s really hard. Yeah.

Isabelle (08:19)
But I took my time to get better. So for eight months I just did yoga, drank all these smoothies and just really took care of myself. And then I thought, I think I can do something, but I don’t know what. And then I just thought of this idea that, well, maybe I could do what I’ve always done, but I’ll work for myself doing it. So I pulled together everything that I’ve ever done, all the strengths, all the experience and offered it out there.

Victoria (08:28)
Yeah.

Isabelle (08:47)
and it went down really well and I hit the ground and yeah, I haven’t looked back.

Victoria (08:54)
I’m thrilled for you that that took off as you described. And I think I can completely relate to what you’re saying about the guilt. mean, so I, for about, I mean, it’s still kind of ongoing, although it’s not as active by any stretch. So I ran a charity with my dad ⁓ and it was all to do with supporting World War II veterans. And the reason it’s not so active is because inevitably there are fewer World War II veterans now.

Isabelle (08:58)
Thank you. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Victoria (09:23)
but it was literally he and I, and we’d have like our team of volunteers. But again, I completely get it. And there are so many parallels with small charities and small businesses in that you are doing everything. And if you go down, everything stops. And I think when it’s a charity, you know, and you have people depending on you, the guilt is at another level. And I can completely understand why.

Isabelle (09:33)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. ⁓

Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria (09:53)
why you decided to step aside. But also I know that you just build such strong connections with the people you work with in a charity as well. And I imagine letting that go must have just been really difficult and quite scary really, because you’re moving to one side and you don’t have a clear path in front of you. You know you need to replenish and repair and get yourself better so you’re fighting fit as best as much as you can be. But it’s very unknown, isn’t it?

Isabelle (10:07)
It was, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, really challenging times, yeah.

Victoria (10:27)
So did your husband work at that time? So he was still working? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, really hard.

Isabelle (10:31)
Yes, yeah. Yeah, fortunately, yeah. Otherwise, yeah, yeah. If I’d been on my own, I really

don’t know how we would have managed. But luckily I did have that support from my husband.

Victoria (10:49)
but then extra pressure on him, suppose. And it all just, everything connects together, doesn’t it? And, you know, of course that’s what we do for each other. It sounds like a really, really difficult time. So when you finally, you you’d kind of built up your strength, you felt like you could, because it’s that reliability of energy. Because as you say, if you keep going backwards, you know, you have a day where you feel like, do you know what? I think I’m really getting there and I’m feeling good. you know, your brain starts to,

Isabelle (10:51)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (11:19)
fire again, and you start to get ideas of what you could do. But then if two or three days later, you feel like you’ve gone back several steps, that’s quite hard to like trust. At what point are you reliably energetic? Not necessarily even to the extent that you were beforehand, but just, you know, that you can count on it, that you’re not going to suddenly have to go to bed. Yeah. Yeah.

Isabelle (11:33)
Yeah.

just to do all the things that I need to do. yeah, I still have that

now. It still goes through my brain every day. Am I doing too much? Am I gonna take a step back? It’s always that, it’s in there somewhere every day. And unfortunately, I’m someone that can’t stop. just, my brain is going at a million miles an hour. I have ideas, scribbling notes. Think, yeah, yeah, oh, I can do this and I can do that. So I’m very…

Victoria (11:46)
Yeah. Yeah.

can relate.

Isabelle (12:08)
on the go and it’s really hard to switch that off. But I really try my best to manage it because I just think, you know, stop Isabel. You’re going to go backwards. Yeah.

Victoria (12:23)
Yeah, and that must be a big learning process for you. ⁓

Isabelle (12:27)
Very much so,

yeah. Learning to rest and stop has been the biggest challenge of my life, because it’s just not something that comes naturally.

Victoria (12:30)
Yeah.

Yeah.

And this is it. There’s so much conversation around women and rest at the moment. ⁓ And it’s, know, to what extent is it innate? You know, there are women who can rest. It’s not like women can’t rest on the whole. So to what extent is it kind of an inner drive? And to what extent is there some conditioning there that we need to be productive and keeping busy and everybody’s relying on us?

Isabelle (12:43)
Hmm.

Yeah, yeah.

Victoria (13:06)
And have you had to kind of unravel that for yourself during this kind of time of healing?

Isabelle (13:10)
Yeah,

yeah I have and I think of this so much conditioning. I am definitely 70 % conditioned to be the way I am and then 30 % is just my nature. Yeah.

Victoria (13:21)
Okay.

Where do you think that conditioning came from, particularly for you? Because we can kind of say societal, but that’s quite broad. I think we all have, you know, particular, we can all sort of remember particular times when we were told something or we overheard something and that kind of fed into how we believed we ought to behave. Can you pinpoint anything in particular?

Isabelle (13:49)
Yeah,

I do think it comes from my mum because she never stopped and she still doesn’t and she gets really impatient with herself if she’s not well and has to rest. So I’ve learned it from my mum I think. Yeah. Sorry mum.

Victoria (14:06)
Yeah. Yeah. It’s so much, it’s modeling, isn’t it? And then, no, no, no, no, no, because my mom has, was

similar. She’s, she’s, she’s had her own kind of health journey to navigate, but as a child, I remember she was always on the go and she, she devoted herself selflessly to looking after all of us. And so that’s, that’s in my mind as a mom, you know, she was a super mom.

Isabelle (14:21)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Victoria (14:35)
she, as far as I was concerned, she did all the things and I never wanted for anything. You know, she anticipated all of our needs and that phrase, super mum, it wasn’t there then, but it’s kind of in our psyche now. What are your views on that?

Isabelle (14:52)
Yeah.

⁓ Yeah, so I’ve been called a super mum so many times and at that point, so this is a whole other little rabbit hole, ⁓ but I… yeah. So when I had my son, I had undiagnosed PND ⁓ and it’s only in hindsight that you can see it. You’re going through these things ⁓ and it was just awful. It was just dire.

Victoria (15:06)
That’s alright, we’ll go down and we’ll come back out again.

Isabelle (15:25)
⁓ and my coping mechanism was to be a super mum. So I did all this charity work. I trained to trek from ⁓ Stonehenge to Avebury. I did big charity auctions. So I was doing all this while feeling awful, ⁓ really in a dark place and really struggling. But that was my way of coping.

So on the outside it looked like, oh wow, she’s doing so well. And so I go, oh, super mum are we? And it was so hurtful. I think that the people that said it didn’t mean to hurt me and they’d probably be really surprised to hear me say this, you know, they, oh, I didn’t mean it that way, but it just felt hurtful because I wasn’t in a good place and I wasn’t a super mum. I was just doing my best to cope and that…

just comes out as having to find purpose, having to keep going. And that’s, it did save me in a way.

Victoria (16:31)
Yeah, it’s complex, isn’t it? Because I’m the same. having two under two, my partner and I had quite extensive couples therapy, because that’s hard. And this is one of the things that she called out in me, and it’s how we respond to stress. And I don’t know if I had depression, but I was certainly in distress. ⁓

Isabelle (16:42)
Yeah, yeah.

Victoria (17:00)
in that I was very, very overwhelmed in those very early stages of motherhood, particularly going from one to two, I think. And I had the similar coping mechanism to you, really. I was just so downproductive. I would not stop. And it’s not wanting to sit with your thoughts to a certain extent, and it’s distraction. So you go and distract. And whereas my partner, he,

Isabelle (17:03)
Mm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yes, yep, yeah.

Victoria (17:29)
is very, very transparent about his mood. So if he is feeling in distress, he will literally like go to bed, he’ll withdraw, he’ll go to bed and close the curtains and hide under the duvet. And it’s very clear to everybody that he’s not feeling good. And that’s actually healthier, although they’re all stress responses, that’s healthier because at least there’s some communication in there. Whereas she would say, well, you will just, I mean, we built this house during COVID.

Isabelle (17:42)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (17:58)
and it’s not finished still. And I would throw myself into that in my second maternity. I’d be like, start painting architraves and I’d go outside and I’d be lugging things around the garden and filling skips and whatever. And she’s like, to anyone else looking at you, you have two small, tiny children and you’re also like clearing a hedge and you’re breastfeeding and then you’re making them lunch.

Isabelle (18:21)
Yeah.

Victoria (18:23)
and then you’re going outside and you’re loading stuff into a skip and then you’re doing a tip run with them in the car and then you’re giving them snacks and then, and it appears like you’ve got it all under control. And actually you are drowning really. You just don’t want to think about it. I think that was quite common. ⁓ So I definitely relate.

Isabelle (18:34)
Yeah.

Yeah, you’re just trying to survive. Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria (18:50)
But it sounds like, mean, underneath it all, all the things that you were doing are so, know, in inverted commas, so good. And actually you’re working and volunteering your time for charities that are all about supporting women. And so that’s interesting. Like you’re not, I was just being very selfish and trying to finish this house. But everything that you’re doing is giving, you know, and so it is complex because that I…

Isabelle (19:05)
Yeah.

Victoria (19:17)
I presume that that was quite therapeutic to you because you’re connecting with other women’s stories the whole time and you feel like you’re helping.

Isabelle (19:25)
Yeah, you’ve hit the nail on the head. Yeah, it’s feeling like you’re making a difference. It made my own situation feel better to feel I was doing something good and helping. Yeah, and it was therapy and all the walking as well that I did was just, I’m sure it saved me. Yeah, but was getting them at five in the morning so that I could do it before my son got up, which is just madness. But yeah.

Victoria (19:42)
Yeah.

There’s

so much that we do in those early years of motherhood that when we kind of come out of the other side, we’re like, why? Why did I put that pressure on myself? But at the time, I don’t know how you feel about it at the time. I I look back and I’m like, I couldn’t have been told, no, I couldn’t have been told, stop it and sit down. There was no stopping me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Isabelle (20:03)
Yes.

Yeah, yeah.

No, what I was doing felt like the most normal thing in the world. Yeah.

Victoria (20:21)
Yeah, it’s complex and the superman thing, I mean, it’s interesting to hear you say that you felt kind of almost wounded by it because, you know, a lot of people, and it’s different for everybody and it just shows how nuanced everyone is, there’s so much gray because some people are literally trying to present that way. And you weren’t doing that, you were just trying to cope in your own way, in a way that felt good to you as you navigate this hard.

Isabelle (20:29)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (20:50)
challenging time, but it’s so loaded and it’s this thing of like doing it all. I’m just, yeah, a bit over that. A bit over that now. No. So, okay, let’s come back to your business. So you were sort of eight months, nine months after you decided to leave the charity. Is that about right from a timeline point of view? And so you…

Isabelle (21:00)
Yeah, no one can do it all. Yeah.

I think so, yeah.

I mean, to be honest, it’s all very hazy and I have very scant recollection of the whole period. But yeah, I think about that. thought, yeah, I can do something. ⁓ And I thought, what can I do? It’s gonna have to be at home. It’s gonna have to work around the kids. And like I say, I just thought, right, well, I’ve heard of this thing called a VA, a virtual assistant. ⁓ I’ll do everything that I’ve ever done, offer that.

just throw it out there ⁓ and see if I get any work. And yeah, apparently people really need all those skills, yeah.

Victoria (21:53)
And you did.

So did that, I mean, again, you can kind of come back to the guilt piece that you talked about with the charity that you didn’t want to let anybody else down. Whereas to do something for yourself, you kind of knew you’re in a position where there was nobody else relying on you. It would just be a case of communicating with your clients and you trying to manage the level of work that you took on. Is that one of the elements that kind of appealed?

Isabelle (22:21)
Yeah.

Yeah, and I was very transparent and honest about it and yeah, sort of built up slowly, added a client. The more confident I got in my ability to manage, I would layer on and add another client in. Yeah, so it was at my pace to an extent. ⁓

Victoria (22:42)
And so when, well, there’s

always client input on that, isn’t there? It’s always something that needs doing urgently once you have that relationship. And that’s kind of bound. Then you are, as a VA, imagine you are sort of at their mercy if something comes up that they need help with.

Isabelle (22:47)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, however, I

will say I have been very lucky with my clients. I lean towards people that have got the same values as me. So I tend to I’ve been very lucky to have very good clients and have good relationships and mutual respect. So it has worked really well.

Victoria (23:21)
Well, that was going to be one of my questions. So how did you find those clients in the first instance? Did you just announce to the world via the internet that you had this service that you wanted to offer and see what happened? How did it work?

Isabelle (23:33)
Well, I struck across the idea that you could become an associate VA. So it’s kind of where I am now is looking towards building a team under my business. And at that stage, there were ladies predominantly that were already doing that. So I thought, maybe that would be a way in, see if I like it. So my first role was as an associate. And I have to say, I’ve still got that role. I can’t let it go.

Victoria (23:58)
Okay.

Isabelle (24:02)
As busy as I am, I’m still can’t let go. So I’m still doing that role now. ⁓ But the hours have vastly reduced. And from there, it’s word of mouth. It just takes off. You just start to get into the right circle. Friends who are business owners put me forward, you know, recommended me and then clients I work with recommended me. And then before you know it, you’ve got a little network and

referrals. Yeah.

Victoria (24:36)
It sounds very organic that you didn’t have to sort of go out and do crazy hustle. And actually,

Isabelle (24:38)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I was lucky

and I don’t think that would have suited me. I wouldn’t have known how to do it at that point. It would have felt really uncomfortable.

Victoria (24:50)
Yeah. But it kind of,

well, I think that’s the thing, you know, when you do go into business for yourself, is, that is the discomfort is in the selling of yourself and your services, especially when you’ve come from a, a J O B and you’ve been protected from all of that, really, you know, you just get your task is distributed to you and you perform it, but you’re not really wondering or yeah, yeah, you’re not, you’re not involved in.

Isabelle (24:59)
Mm.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, it’s a totally new world.

Victoria (25:19)
where does the task come from? Where does the client come from? And so the fact that you didn’t have to get too into that is kind of really nice. That is hard.

Isabelle (25:27)
Yeah, I was very lucky. Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria (25:33)
So why don’t you tell me, for anybody listening that doesn’t know, typically what does a VA do? And a VA is a virtual assistant.

Isabelle (25:45)
Yeah, so ⁓ it’s such a broad area and it really depends on your skill set. ⁓ Every industry needs virtual assistants, so it could be industry based, depending on your background. It could be a lot of admin. It can be being the right hand to a founder. ⁓ I do board support for a charity.

So it’s that there are so many different things that it can be. And I was talking about this with a group of virtual assistants a couple of months ago, and we realized we all sat down and having coffee and we realized that we all do something completely different. So it’s really hard to say exactly what it is, but it is basically supporting a business in some way. And it’s done remotely, usually.

Victoria (26:39)
And so, well, yeah, but this is the thing. It kind of aligns really naturally with this change that we saw during COVID and the explosion of online businesses. And I think actually the VA role, it’s very, it’s new because previously, and it comes back to this whole argument about whether or not people need to be in offices together, which I know is like a hot topic at the moment. But prior to COVID, it wasn’t,

Isabelle (27:05)
Yeah, yeah.

Victoria (27:09)
really as big a thing as it is now. And I think the fact that the pandemic forced us to all work remotely, it really did show that that’s possible. I think the assumption beforehand was that everyone would just skive off.

Isabelle (27:17)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, that’s exactly it. Yeah. And it was the same with working from home, if you had an office job. It was almost unheard of for most people to be able to do hybrid working. Yeah, it’s changed so much. And it’s such a valuable role to small businesses. If you can’t hire someone, to be able to have that support is just invaluable. But I think for a lot of people, it’s finding the right person.

and being able to trust them. Trust is the biggest thing.

Victoria (27:56)
Yeah, I can imagine. I’ve never worked with VA. And I mean, I would definitely like to think that one day that’s something that I would do. And I think if that comes about, the trust element, and that would be my resistance to it. It’s like, I wouldn’t know where to start and find that person because you do want them, like you said, you want them to share your values. And if they have some experience in your field.

Or, and I suppose it’s about identifying the tasks as a small business owner that either you don’t want to do, you’re not good at, or that are keeping you in the weeds of your business and then finding the right person to do that. What advice would you give to a small business owner that is really bogged down and has the income that could justify a VA?

Isabelle (28:38)
Yeah.

Victoria (28:55)
How would you advise them to go about finding that right fit person for them?

Isabelle (29:02)
think LinkedIn is a good place to start. I’m sure most people will know a VA or know someone that knows a VA. So often a way in is someone that you already know or someone that you know already knows someone. ⁓ And start small. Just pick one task that you’d like to offload, maybe a bit of online research.

or if you feel brave enough, hand over the management of your inbox and just start small and see how it goes. And any good VA will support you. They’ll immediately have ideas about how you can be supported in your business and what is gonna help you.

Victoria (29:46)
See, this is the thing as well, because I think when I think of VA, I’m thinking that they are functionary, that you’re giving them a task and they’re doing that task. But actually that’s very rude of me because they are humans with a great deal of experience in business, in supporting business owners and that they might actually…

know how to support you better than you know how to be supported, if that makes sense, and that they bring something to the table that will help you.

Isabelle (30:17)
Yeah, yeah, yeah,

yeah. ⁓ And there’s also a fine line. I’m sort of merging my role. I suppose I’ve never actually been a virtual assistant just to add an extra complication. I’ve always been an online business manager, but I didn’t realize I thought I was being a VA. So you’re right to say that VA work is execution and very task driven. But I think a lot of us.

like you say, have all this experience and knowledge and actually online business management managers in disguise. So that tends to be more of the work that I do now. It’s a lot more high level, a lot more strategy, a lot more project management. ⁓

Victoria (30:56)
Yeah.

So tell me about the structure then of the business that you are in the process of building with your team. So in that sense, somebody could be coming to you with, they want to outsource a functional task and you would allocate that to a VA in your team, but then they are in your client box and you then are building a relationship with them as a group, as a company.

Isabelle (31:25)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (31:36)
And you can then come in and start to offer advice and sort of help them through that outsourcing process really, because I think that’s so scary to a small business owner. you think about, you know, a mom who’s building a business from her kitchen table during nap time or in between the school runs, you know, when that starts to gain traction and she can’t manage the thought of outsourcing because your business is your baby, isn’t it? Just like your children are your baby.

Isabelle (31:42)
Yes, yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah,

yeah. It’s, it’s a, yeah. I just, yeah, you really have to find someone you can trust. Yeah.

Victoria (32:07)
So what, go on.

So tell me about, so go on, I’ll let you answer the question. So tell me about the structure of your business. Why have you decided to build it this way and how do you see it growing? So over the next sort of five years, where would you like to be and what would you like to be able to offer in that time?

Isabelle (32:31)
So my ideal ⁓ is to continue with the online business management and to have a trusted team working with me. ⁓ Potentially they will ⁓ own a client on their own or others ⁓ may be led by me and take tasks on. I suppose it depends on what the client wants and what the associate wants and what works best for them. ⁓

building a structure and a framework so that everything is, they’ve got a base because what I find, a lot of the VA agencies and lead VAs, and I’m sure this doesn’t apply to all of them, but they tend to match up a VA to a business owner and then they’re sort of left to get on with it. And I just think there’s no community in that. I really would like to have a team.

that can bounce ideas of each other and know who they are and meet, even if it’s online and work as a team, rather than, right, here’s your client, off you go, and then you only hear from me to have your invoice paid. And that, yeah, as a model, that doesn’t quite fit with what I want.

Victoria (33:44)
Yeah.

And I guess in building that community, you’ve just got more brains in the game, really. If you can bring more people into that relationship, everyone’s going to have their own ideas and you can all kind of spark off each other.

Isabelle (33:58)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

That’s it. Yeah.

And you can’t share those ideas if you’re not talking. So, yeah.

Victoria (34:14)
And I imagine that’s quite lonely for the VA if that is the case.

Isabelle (34:17)
Yeah,

I think so. Yeah. It depends on the sort of person you are, I suppose. But a lot of us, I mean, we’re social creatures, aren’t we? So, yeah.

Victoria (34:19)
Yeah.

Yeah,

yeah, and especially women. mean, do you have a mix of men and women that you’re intending to build this team from? Do men, I mean, this is a very sexist question. Are there a lot of men who are going into this field? Because in my head, actually, there’s a lot of women.

Isabelle (34:43)
Yeah, but it’s growing. There are more and more men coming along, yeah, which is great because they bring their own experiences to the network and it’s good to see. ⁓ But I particularly would like to empower women, women that were like me, that had given up a career and, or what do I do now? ⁓

Victoria (34:46)
Okay, good.

Isabelle (35:09)
and would love to be able to support them and help them on this journey if this is the journey they want to go on.

Victoria (35:17)
Yeah, and it ties back into, I mean, being a VA, I imagine is an ideal job for a mum in the early years of motherhood, raising her kids, because really that flexibility and being able to add value, I think there’s so much in the kind of mindset of recognizing if that is the case for you, that…

the job and the career you had before is not going to work because there’s a lack of flexibility or a lack of understanding, a lack of compassion, all of the things that we hear so much about, that you’ve got this rigid business model and no, you can’t go down to four days or you can go down to four, but you’ll basically be doing five, but you can’t get down to three and all of the rules that kind of, that that framework kind of exists around. And then actually that can, yeah, it’s quite damaging to your mental health at a time when you’re

Isabelle (35:57)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It’s so hard. Yeah.

Mm.

Victoria (36:09)
fragile anyway, and you’re trying to navigate what it is to be a mum. To be kind of, and it can feel like a rejection or it can feel like you’re no longer of value. All of these emotions at play, so, so difficult. And actually you do have an awful lot to offer because that experience has not gone. All that big career that you had before you had children is still there and all those learnings that you gathered. And

Isabelle (36:10)
Mmm.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (36:39)
You can get an awful lot done in a short space of time when you’re a mum. Yeah.

Isabelle (36:41)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you learn that skill fast. ⁓ And I was

gonna say, and I know so many women, educated, experienced, clever women that take part-time jobs, fill in shelves or, know, that kind of thing. And that’s great if that’s what you want and that suits you. But the thought that people are doing that because they think that’s the only way they can earn some money is just…

Victoria (37:00)
Yeah.

Isabelle (37:10)
It’s just so unjust.

Victoria (37:14)
Yeah, and it really impacts, I imagine, their confidence because once you settle in to a role like that, I mean, there’s different things. How’d you get back out? Yeah, and you feel like you’re out of the game and you feel like the world’s carrying on without you. I used to quite like the idea of like maybe working in a cafe because I just thought I could just drink coffee and eat cake and talk to people. And that’s okay, you know, there’s something about the social element that mothers need as well. It’s all these different types of rest and that would be kind of a social rest.

Isabelle (37:21)
How’d you get back out? Yeah. Hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, be relaxed.

Yeah.

Victoria (37:44)
⁓ but yeah, the idea of going and working at a checkout somewhere. And, and I don’t know, I suppose you would be working with people who perhaps didn’t have that same career experience and you, just, you forget your worth and you forget your, just all the things that you have to offer. So I think a VA, I imagine, and I imagine as well, it

Yes, you can have functional roles that feel repetitive and you know what you’re doing, but I can imagine, you know, if you have a few different clients, there’s quite a lot of diversity and challenge. Has that been your experience?

Isabelle (38:21)
Yeah, definitely.

And you learn so much. I have learned so much about running businesses from being in the operation of different types of businesses with different people and being around such ambitious people. It raises your game. So it’s really a good world to be in. Yeah.

Victoria (38:38)
Yeah.

Yeah, I hadn’t thought of that, but yeah, there’s so much in kind of like the spirit of the conversations that you’re having day to day. And especially I imagine if you are enabling a founder who is drowning to kind of get back into that, you know, entrepreneurial mindset and stop kind of, you know, just drowning in that inbox or, know, whether it’s social media or whether it’s whatever, and they can start to have a bit of

Isabelle (39:07)
Yeah.

Victoria (39:11)
brain capacity to actually think on a higher level again, then you’re going to be bouncing off them. They’ll be feeling a lot more lively and excited about their business. And that is always really infectious.

Isabelle (39:16)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah,

it’s a great partnership ⁓ and if you get someone like me, I’m really invested in the business. So all their businesses become my babies and I’ll wake up in middle of the night, we could do this. Because to me, their businesses are my businesses too. So yeah, you get really invested. And that’s all down to finding the right people that you align with.

Victoria (39:37)
⁓ that’s cool. ⁓

Yeah, and naturally, mean…

Yeah.

Isabelle (39:52)
That’s the key.

Victoria (39:54)
Yeah, and that is the challenge, I think, that’s where the resistance is, isn’t it? And then I think it makes sense that it’s word of mouth because you wouldn’t know where to start, really. If you’re just Googling, it’s such a precious role. And it’s actually quite hard. Do find there’s a bit of resistance for business owners to let go?

Isabelle (40:10)
Yeah. Yeah.

Definitely, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But, yeah.

Victoria (40:24)
I could do that for you and they’re like,

no, it’s okay.

Isabelle (40:31)
but I’m very confident in the fact that they will trust me. So I just sit back, do my thing and wait for the trust to come, because it comes.

Victoria (40:42)
Yeah, and it’s every action and every bit of performance that they see is that reliability factor. That’s quite…

Isabelle (40:48)
Yeah, it’s every day, yeah, yeah. You have to work really hard

at showing your reliability and the fact that you’re not going anywhere. If you say something, you will do it. And if you can’t do something, you said you will, you immediately say why. Being accountable. So if a mistake happens, put your hand up straight away. It’s just making sure that they can see that, yeah, they can trust you.

Victoria (41:13)
I imagine that requires quite lot of patience on your part with certain entrepreneurs. And the thing is you can see all the time you can give them back once they start to build that trust and once they give you more and more and more to do. You can see how that would help their business to grow and perhaps they’re just so close to it and they’ve done it for such a long time in their own particular way. It’s kind of a journey that you both need to go on together.

but I imagine the rewards are massive.

Isabelle (41:45)
Yeah, and I have to say, I mean, I haven’t come across it yet, but they tend to trust me pretty quickly. We don’t really have much resistance, but it would be good to experience that.

Victoria (41:55)
I trust you already.

We’ve been on the phone, on the phone. We’ve been recording for 40 minutes and I trust you. So I can totally see it. It’s all right. No, I can totally see it though, but you you’re very warm and it’s obvious that you really care about what you’re doing. that’s all at the end of the day. That’s the biggest thing, isn’t it? To know that…

Isabelle (41:59)
You

Thank you Victoria.

Yeah, I think so.

Victoria (42:23)
Yeah, to know that you can be as invested.

Isabelle (42:24)
Things can be taught, but yeah, but that attitude can’t be taught.

Victoria (42:30)
Is there anything that you would advise business owners to do in advance of outsourcing some of those day-to-day tasks to a VA to make that transition easier? I’ve heard of people kind of sort of writing down workflows and kind of just making a note of their processes. What would you advise there just to kind of…

Because I imagine there are some businesses that you kind of go into and everything’s a mess and you don’t really know where to start. So what would you suggest that business owners do to kind of prepare for when that time comes?

Isabelle (43:07)
So I’m used to time recording and I suppose it depends on what kind of business you’ve got as to whether you time record. There’s apps, you know, where you can time what you’re doing. And if they can, I would time the different type of tasks that you do and then in a piece of software that can give you a pie chart showing where your time goes.

Victoria (43:20)
Okay.

Isabelle (43:34)
So say if you’re spending an hour on your inbox, if you have a time set up for that and see where your time goes and then you can see clearly in a pie chart, maybe I’m spending too much time on those admin tasks and that you can pinpoint that as an area that you could hand over pretty quickly.

Victoria (43:59)
imagine that’s harrowing.

once a night.

You know, for business owners think how long they’re spending making an Instagram reel when actually they should be doing XYZ that’s moving the needle.

Isabelle (44:13)
Yeah, but hopefully they could

then think, my gosh, yes, I really need to hand over that pretty quick.

Victoria (44:17)
Yeah.

Yeah. Or else, I mean, even, even before they get to that stage, that is a really good exercise to do just in terms of your own strategy. Like, are you spending the time in the right places? Are you spending time where it’s moving the needle? Yeah. Is what you’re spending all day doing actually making you any money? Again, I don’t really want to know. ⁓ But no, that’s such good advice. Such good advice.

Isabelle (44:32)
Where you, yeah, where you want to be, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (44:50)
So how do you feel now in terms of your health and your business and where you’re at in your journey as a mom? Do you kind of momentum? I feel like you’re kind of excited about things kind of coming together, but how do you tell me? How do you feel?

Isabelle (45:16)
Yeah, I am excited. I’m quite ambitious. ⁓ Lots to look forward to, but every day I wing it. You know, it’s, it is a juggle every day. I don’t have it all together. I don’t have it all sorted. I wing it every day. ⁓ But yeah, still excited and yeah, pulling it all together.

Victoria (45:44)
It’s a lot though, isn’t it? I think, I mean, I think we’re all, we’re all winging it. Do you think that the conversation around what it is to be a mum, a working mum, whether that’s a business owner or whether that’s ⁓ a career driven working mum, do you think that conversation has changed since when you first became a mother? Do you think it’s?

evolved in any way.

Isabelle (46:15)
mean, that is a good question.

I wonder if… So he’s nearly 15.

Victoria (46:20)
Because how old is your eldest?

Yeah.

Isabelle (46:27)
but I wonder if it has.

think it depends on who you are and what circles you’re in.

Victoria (46:39)
Yeah, I think from my point of view, the reason for starting this podcast, like mothers have a very particular relationship with their businesses because they need their businesses to work for them. I think if you are child free, you can work for your business without giving it too many second thoughts, you know, and you can throw everything at it. And in that sense, you

Isabelle (47:05)
Yeah.

Victoria (47:09)
you have more time, arguably because you have more time, you’re more likely to make a success of it because you’re not, and it’s not the right word, but you’re not encumbered by any other responsibilities. But there’s also a richness and a sense of clarity and perspective that a mum can bring that, you know, she’s looking to make a positive impact because

she’s trying to make the world a bit better for her kids. And I certainly get a sense of that with the way, with the values that you’re bringing to your business. And this whole thing about empowering other women and supporting other women to create that for themselves, that working life where they’re able to be present with their kids. And that comes back to this relationship that you’ve had with charities that are doing that work.

Isabelle (47:40)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (48:08)
And you work with a particular charity now who is doing brilliant things in that space. So tell me about that.

Isabelle (48:11)
I do, yeah.

Yeah, so I’ve worked with the Maternal Mental Health Alliance, ⁓ supported their Board of Trustees for about two years, I think, and they are amazing. They are my passion project. ⁓ They are just doing amazing things at the moment. And in particular, they have a photography exhibition that’s taking place in London in November.

⁓ And I have had a little preview of some of the photography and it is so powerful. It’s the journey from before motherhood to during motherhood and then towards as you settle in into it. there’s a juxtaposition of the person before, the person at the start and then the mother today. each story is, yeah, it’s really powerful.

Victoria (49:05)
I love that.

Isabelle (49:09)
and the stories are so diverse. ⁓ It’s at, I’ve written it down somewhere, it’s the Phillips at 30 Barkley Square, and it’s on a couple of dates in November, and it is free entry. Donations are welcome, but it’s free entry.

Victoria (49:10)
Where is this?

Okay.

Okay, cool. I’m going to try and try and go. As a photographer, just, I don’t, feel like I don’t spend enough time actually looking at photographs. Yeah, that sounds amazing. And I mean, photography is, is so powerful in its ability to express things immediately that it would take you quite a while to articulate in words. And I’m so, I mean, it’s the same, know, I love that there are

Isabelle (49:28)
Yeah, I would. Yeah. I thought you would. Yeah. Yeah, I think you’re gonna love it.

Yeah.

Victoria (49:53)
these kind of like artistic representations of motherhood. And it’s named the sculpture that they just directed in London of the postpartum woman. I really want to see that because I just think we are overloaded with statues of men going into battle. like, can we just have some women keeping the human race going celebrated in public art? So that sounds amazing.

Isabelle (50:00)
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (50:21)
So what specifically, what is their mission statement, the charity?

Isabelle (50:25)
So they won’t stop until every mother, every family has high quality perinatal mental health support. That’s their mission. Yeah.

Victoria (50:41)
Gosh, that sounds so good. So good because I always talk about the shock of becoming a mother because that was my experience that it was just a shock. I debate the extent to which you can prepare for it, but I love that there is a charity out there arguing that you can better prepare for it and that you can feel supported because there’s something about that shock occurring and then support.

Isabelle (50:51)
Yeah, complete shock. Yeah.

Victoria (51:11)
from the state if you like. And I understand that resources are stretched, but that support feels like it falls off a cliff the moment you have your healthy baby. And especially the support from mum.

Isabelle (51:19)
Yeah, and it’s just, yeah,

far reaching repercussions for not supporting women with their mental health, yeah.

Victoria (51:26)
Yeah.

Yeah. Well, and as you say, you you, you feel now that you had undiagnosed postnatal depression. I’ve spoken to, mean, this, this podcast is on, you know, it’s just published episode 16. It’s new. And several women that I’ve interviewed have said that they suspect they had PND and didn’t, didn’t have any support.

Isabelle (51:33)
Mmm.

Yeah.

It just goes to show how important the work

is of the MMHE. Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria (51:54)
Yeah. Well, it’s,

heard the other day it’s the, it’s the biggest hormone drop that a human can ever experience after you give birth. You know, your body is full and flooded with hormones and you’re supposed to be, you know, luminous and glowing and you’re, know, you’re radiating and then you have your baby. And I felt like, I’m sure every mother did, but I just felt like my whole health fell off a cliff, you know, and I look in the mirror and I was glowing five days ago and now I look gray and I look.

Isabelle (52:09)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (52:24)
ill

and you know, just the physical repercussions of the act of giving birth. But then obviously that hormone drop has enormous psychological ramifications. And I am going to go and like research this charity as soon as we get off this call, because I think that’s really important work. So tell me how can people go and connect with the charity? Where should they go? Are they on social media? Where’s a good place to look that up?

Isabelle (52:46)
Yeah.

Yeah, you can find

them on Instagram. I think it’s at MMHA. They have a website, maternalmentalhealthalliance.org, and you’ll find everything you need to know about them on there, including the This is Also Motherhood exhibition.

Victoria (52:58)
Okay.

Okay, brilliant. All right then, I have one last question for you.

You’ve had a hard time of it in motherhood with long COVID. I mean, that’s a curve ball. As you said, you were really healthy, in good shape, just out of the blue. That has knocked you, but you’ve come back from that. You’re building your business. Looking back now, what would you say to the eight-year-old little girl you once were?

Isabelle (53:29)
Mm.

my gosh. ⁓ You’re stronger than you know. Yeah.

Victoria (53:56)
It’s simple and to the point. I love it. think we could all say that to our younger selves. I think kind of as we edge out of that age of innocence in childhood and start to become more self-aware, the self-doubt kind of kicks in, but actually what you’ve overcome, you know, from post-natal depression, you know, career pivots and long COVID and building your business.

Isabelle (53:58)
That’s me. ⁓

Yeah.

Yeah.

Victoria (54:26)
Yeah, there’s no doubt how strong you are and you keep going. It’s an exciting time for IsWizVA.

Isabelle (54:32)
It is. Thank you very much Victoria.

Victoria (54:36)
That’s all right. Tell me where people can go and connect with you online and learn more about your business.

Isabelle (54:43)
You can find me at izwizva.co.uk. You can find me on LinkedIn, Isabelle Piescy, or on Instagram at izwiz underscore VA.

Victoria (54:57)
amazing. Thank you so much for your time as well. It’s been really lovely talking with you.

Isabelle (55:00)
It’s

been amazing. Thank you so much Victoria.

Victoria (55:07)
You’re welcome.